What We Need Now: Quiet Storm – A Mixtape of Hot Takes

November 18, 2021

In the Finale episode for WWNN Season 2 we explore a host of topics on our mixtape!

Yes you read that heading correctly, the What We Need Now crew has created a mixtape of our hot takes because who doesn’t love a good mixtape?

In this special edition of What We Need Now we have created a lyrical “bookend” to the great ideas and conversations we held throughout Season 2. The core of this episode will be about highlighting, in the theme of tracks on a “mixtape.” Music will be a bridging component between the tracks/conversations and highlight the different creative styles we embody on the team. In addition to breaking down the happenings of season 2, we will be exploring key questions that each host would like to ask other hosts. 

On this episode of What We Need Now, we are welcoming back WWNN alumnae Lauren Wiggins and Jonathan Butler who join the rest of the team in discussing white supremacy culture, what brings us to the work, our creative process, and what we can share without losing our jobs. 


Listen on Spotify, Apple or wherever you listen to podcasts!




Lauren (she/they) was a Digital Campaigner at Greenpeace and lives on stolen Muscogee (Creek) land in Atlanta, Georgia. She volunteers for local environmental justice campaigns at the West Atlanta Watershed Alliance, and is the co-founder of a national grassroots art collective (check us out at BeTheGreen.win) that works to creatively communicate the possibility of a just transition to a Green New Deal. She lives for her passion of liberating the oppressed, and connecting people with the fascinating, inspiring, and healing elements of nature.


Jonathan (they/them) is an Artist, Organizer, and Culture Worker organizing to build power in their community, and across the African Diaspora, to affect structural change and empower communities, both in meeting material needs and in long-term policy shifts. With 10+ years of organizing and campaigning experience, Jonathan believes in fighting to give people back their power from corporations and powerful interests and has been doing so through organizations like BYP100, Greenpeace USA, and others. Jonathan believes in utilizing art and cultural organizing as core tools to build the collective radical imagination of what is possible in our lifetime while continuing to make progress on the day-to-day issues we face.



Rico Sisney(he/him) is a musician, and organizer from Chicago, IL now based on Ohlone Land on the West Coast of the United States. Rico started with Greenpeace over 10 years ago working to support local efforts to shut down two of the dirtiest coal power plants in the country. In 2019, he was one of 22 activists who demonstrated at the Fred Hartman Bridge on the eve of the third Democratic primary debate in Houston calling for leaders to imagine a world beyond fossil fuels and embrace a just transition to renewable energy. As the emcee for Sidewalk Chalk(Ropeadope Records) and the vocalist/keyboardist for House of Whales, an alternative hiphop group based in Oakland, CA, Rico uses lyricism to address injustice, tell stories and imagine a better world.


Ishmael Herod aka Ish (he/him) is a DC karaoke enthusiast and has been with Greenpeace since 2011. He currently manages the Talent Acquisition team at Greenpeace and has been working constantly to ensure the organization is bringing in diverse, dedicated people to advance our work and help the fight for environmental and social justice.



Jasmine (she/her) worked in the IT & Data Department at Greenpeace. She was the resident Data Guru at Greenpeace and has been a huge star in supporting the environmental movement through her lens. She is based on Piscataway Land, otherwise known as Washington DC.


Track 1 – White Supremacy Culture Still Ain’t Cool


Rico Welcome to the Quiet Storm. This is our season finale and this is more than an episode. It is a conversational mixtape with 5 tracks and some interludes. So you’re gonna be hearing from all of the co-hosts and co-producers of What We Need Now– we got everybody in the studio right now. It’s gonna be amazing. 

Throughout season 2 we’ve been discussing how the delusion of white supremacy impacts everything: from our environment to our democracy, to our food to our data and more importantly, we’ve heard about the work that Black and Brown folks are doing past, present and future to deal with or repair some of these broken systems. So, today we’re specifically talking about white supremacy culture. It’s honestly an exhausting topic and since we’ve covered it pretty exhaustively, this will be the shortest track. Just to make sure we’re all on the same page, we got a working definition of white supremacy culture as the widespread ideology baked into the beliefs, values, norms and standards of our groups– many if not most of them– our communities, our towns, our states, our nation– teaching us overtly and covertly that whiteness holds value that whiteness is value and devaluing all other communities and all other groups. And some of the characteristics of that are things like Perfectionism…Can y’all help me out? What– what are some other characteristics of white supremacy culture.

jas A sense of urgency.
Lauren Individualism.
Ish Worship of written word 
Jonathan Quantity over quality.
Ish Fear of conflict.
Rico Yep and the right to comfort right?.
Jas Either or thinking.
Jonathan Defensiveness, and if I can add white tears.
Lauren Paternalism.
Rico Yup, yup. So cool, now that we have a working definition of what we’re talking about when we say white supremacy culture.  I just wanted to ask a couple questions and I’m gonna start with you Lauren. You’re in a lot of different spaces. You’re in like movement spaces you’re in climate and now you’re now you’re in Ivy League… You know what I mean? Shout out to you. Um, and I just want to hear like how have you seen white supremacy culture show up and has it shown up differently in these spaces?
Lauren I think the biggest way I see it show up consistently is, in this way of like people thinking they know what’s best and trying to for lack of a better term maybe micromanage you to do things a certain way and to achieve a particular goal. Even when it’s something…maybe it doesn’t align with your own values and maybe you lightly express that or don’t. So I will say and and just to like –when I do see white supremacy culture show up,  I’ve had to grow into this place where I can advocate for myself and address it– when I see it occurring. Because I think people don’t intentionally, ever want to make somebody feel like they’re belittled or like their opinion or their mode of thinking or their strategies aren’t effective. I just think when you grow up in a space that consistently validates your frame of thinking, it’s hard for you to maybe understand or receive another person’s. And I’m experiencing that even now just being academia. It’s funny though. I’ve also experienced it in my um, you know work situations also just in the climate movement in general even when if I’m volunteering even at protest–definitely experience that white supremacy culture. And it’s just this idea of like, “no, this is the way that we’ve decided that it’s most efficient. That it’s most effective that it gives, you know it gives that most all effect um, based on my frame of thinking and the work that I’ve done in this situation” and I’m I’m channeling people who obviously express that white supremacy culture. 
Rico I actually want to quote you quoting the wire back at you, people want it to be one way you know? just the idea that the way that you’ve experienced it the way you understand it is just that’s the way it works. That’s the only way it works.
Lauren Yeah.
Rico I want to ask I want to ask Jasmine so like you also you’re in a space that is not typically I don’t see a lot of Black folks I don’t see a lot of Black women in Data. And so you’re like in a bubble inside of a bubble working in the environmental movement specifically with data. I just want to know like you know, um I guess really how you navigate that or or even you know if you wanted to speak to some of the characteristics of white supremacy culture that impact your work.
Jas I’m like Lauren. I’m still kind of learning how to navigate this space. I’m relatively new to the data realm, so every day it feels like a new trial to conquer which you know someone has to unfortunately be the first. I’m not saying that I’m the first, nor the only but there might be like 5 of us. Anyway, it’s challenging I think especially because tech data people tend to be really just like methodical, like stick to the facts kind of people. So, I think one of the things that I often rub up against is like there is just one way of thinking. There’s one way to accomplish this. There’s no room for any deviation. In some instances, that makes sense. You know? You have your standard procedures that you have to follow. But then that also limits a lot of the creativity and the applications of data. So I think more because there is this white supremacy culture it cuts down on the amazing things that data can do and it also cuts down on the people not wanting to be interested in data. Like I was like, “Eww, this is boring. This is for like white men. I’m like repulsed by this.” I also feel similarly about finances. Anyway, but I’ve seen so many amazing Black people, especially Black women working in these data fields. Pioneering things and just honestly like you have to have Black people in the room you have to have lots of diversity within that space to create and really get the best ideas flowing and that’s not happening and there’s a lot of pushback and resentment, I think towards that. Not saying that’s particularly happening within my exact space but I see it when I talk to you my peers across different orgs and yeah, it’s happening.
Lauren Yeah, and I just wanted to um, kind of stay on the same train of giving like narrative perspective as Jasmine was doing. Obviously, it’s really difficult to advocate for yourself, especially when you’re dealing with something as deep as like, “Oh this like hurt me emotionally the way I’m being treated.” But, I can say like for instance, one thing I’m experiencing right now is I’m on a team-group in a wonderful course and  there is one white male that is actually like… he sort of took the onus upon himself to be the leader. And by that I mean like suggesting what parts certain people should work on. Like he literally was just like, “Hey Lauren, since you have a background of blah blah blah, I think you would be great for this. Like literally dictating not only who does what, but also how we present our work. Like he was like, “Oh I think we should give this appraisal. We should structure it this way, it should be formatted this way. We should word it this way and like I remember he said something to one of our counterparts, I believe he’s from China and he was just saying… he said something to Wey about like, “Hey could you kind of word your your portion in the same way that I worded mine?” and it was like, “wow, dude. This is…” and this is this is real stuff yall this happened this earlier this week we had a large group paper to turn in. And right now I’m trying to navigate a space where I want to approach him and just ah say what I’ve been witnessing but also just say, “Hey,maybe we can explore rotational leadership. Maybe we could also just explore a culture of you know,  what is the what is ah the phrase like step back step in step back. 
Rico So step up step back.
Lauren Thank you step up step back. You know.

Um, so I do realize like we probably… We should have set some group norms beforehand. But my point is like addressing white supremacy culture can be something as, you know, small as doing what I’m actually planning to do and that’s just like lightly coming up to my teammate and just saying like, “Hey, I know we’ve been doing great work together. But. There are a few things that I’d like to talk about and maybe some solutions on how we can work moving forward because we’re going to be on these projects for the rest of the Semester. So I really I have to get with it.” But yeah.

Rico Now That’s I mean it’s a gift to give that feedback because if you have existed in such a in a way that noone has ever interrupted that or told you that it’s not correct like you have no reason to think that it’s not… That you know your ideas aren’t just heard because they’re the best ideas you know? Or whatever, whatever sort of like feelings that person might have about why they need to be in the leadership position.
Lauren Yeah right? And I think it’s about recognizing that intent versus impact piece that we hear all the time. I’m sure all of us probably listening into the podcast, I know we’ve heard that y’all. But I think it has so much validity there and it allows me to enter every space with compassion too and just know that like Nobody. Noone who exudes that white supremacy culture is like intentionally doing it and if you can muster the courage within yourself and it feels right for you if it’s just not–if it proves to be a less stressful thing for you to address it than to continue to endure it I think you should you should find a way. And if you need to do like me. Um, sometimes I gotta write down I actually like take take some time and figure out “how am I going to address this in a very calm and diplomatic manner and not come off like– You know the angry black woman too?” I do try to make sure that I can like hone my own emotions because this is something that turns out to be emotional because it feels like you know people are questioning your own capability. Yeah I’m sorry.
Jas It. It’s an attack and I was just gonna offer like people feel attacked when you come and address them at least in my experience because they feel uncomfortable and don’t know how to lean into that space. So.
Lauren They do.
Lauren Um, yeah, yeah.
Rico The podcast team in particular has been such ah a great space for me because I think that. I’ve seen folks like be vulnerable and be emotional and be connected and like go slower to make sure we get consent and all of these kinds of things that you don’t necessarily realize are absent until you see them present. If you have any other suggestions for like how folks can navigate this. We can wrap with that.
Jas Kind of Rico what you’re– what you’ve said and what Lauren is offering, like you have to tell people how you want to be treated so I will Voice like before I talk to someone new or remind them that like, “hey I have you know dah-da needs. I like to be communicated with this way. I need this kind of thing. Like I don’t think anyone should ever be afraid to say those things because it just makes the work better. It just makes you be able to be more efficient. Um, so I think that’s a one way to address white supremacy because there is just like this. “We’re gonna–you know hunker down, get down to work.” There’s no space of like you’re allowed to be a person. So you have to create that space I think for yourself and don’t be afraid because I think a lot of people are afraid. To be like, “Oh well, they’re going to think I’m incapable but like I’m going to be incapable if I don’t tell you what I need to do my job so…
Rico Yeah, did you have something as well Lauren? I can’t tell if it was a snap or a hand the show.
Lauren I no I think oh that was it’s just a snap affirmation asha asha asha um, yeah I know I think Jasmine said it all perfectly.
Rico Love it. Cool all right? Well, that’s that’s that on that. Thank you both.



INTERLUDE: Khair’s Inner Monologue

KHAIR V.O: This meeting should have been an email…

Person A: And then my cat just cuddled with me instead

Facilitator: (Canned laughter) Well it feels like we’ve bonded now, so lets get into it. Obviously there’s been some unsettling news recently and we need to do something about it. What do we have coming up in terms of uh…Black–Diversity and Inclusion? 

Yeahso  I partnered with um..Khair 

KHAIR V.O: Why can’t any of y’all pronounce my name?

Person B: and we wrote a really powerful blog piece that’s on our website and we’re getting a lot of click-through rates. It’s amazing

Person C: Oh nice!. Khair also found some really cool resources that I shared with our network

Person A: And some of our allies requested that we sit in on some planning sessions for some on the ground work.

Mmm..I know where this is going…

Facilitator: Oh thats exciting. Is there anyone who wants to take lead on that? It should probably be someone who holds some close relationships to Black uh…communities of color.

KHAIR (V.O): Somebody is about to voluntell me.

Facilitator: Anybody?

Person B: Khair you’re muted I dunno if you might want to say something about this…

KHAIR V.O: Nope. 

PERSON A: Yes Khair(Shayeear) would be great for this. 

Person C: Yes! I agree Khair(pronounced Khayree) would be amazing

KHAIR V.O: Oh my God

Person B: Oh my gosh Yes thats a great idea I second that nomination

Facilitator: Alright then it’s settled. Khair would you be open to doing this?

Khair (V.O) – (sigh) deep breath. Remember why you do this work


Track 2 – What Brings you to THEE work


Lauren So, we know it takes a real special kind of person to join the movement for change and with the outlooks being so bleak and the wins being so few and far in between, we know it takes a really special movement– a really special moment also to stay. And I want to say, one of my special moments were taking place mostly around 2016. I got involved into some election work particularly I’ma just put it out there I was supporting um, Hillary. And it was some of the most stressful moments of my life but also some of the most rewarding. I think for me the opportunity to meet people who were so steadfast in this idea that we can build a world that doesn’t continue to harbor that–that greed you know? That that xenophobia that hate that I often find that the people who–who are in charge tend to hold. Just meeting those types of people in the movement in 2016 that’s what told me like all right. Even though we may have lost this fight, I’m in it for the long run. So with that,I want to ask a couple of folks what brings you to the work? What allows you to show up every day? What allows you to keep pushing on even in those moments where you just feel so defeated and you know everything seems, let’s be quite frank, hopeless.  How do you yourself evade that despondency? 
Ish Yeah, that’s a really interesting question like you know what brings me to the work cause like that’s a question I always find myself asking when I’m like a little bit uncertain about like how I want to progress in this–I don’t want to say the organization but the movement just as a whole. Like when I first started like I was just out of college Howard University H.U you know? and then I was like I’m not gonna go back home I was like I don’t want to do that like I want to be on my own I want to be independent and I want to be doing something that actually mattered. So, was I the biggest environmental head? Nah. Not even close. But when I first heard about Greenpeace, like I saw canvassers out on the street and they were like yeah, let’s talk. And I was like alright cool and I found out it was independent and I was like that’s kind of the vibes I was looking for. I was like, “I don’t want to go home I want to be on my own. I Wanna really really be in a spot where I can be independent and just like do that. So, once I kind of like got into the organization, It was more like, “Alright. I see things are happening this is cool.” And I started to learn more and the more I learned about the issues about the different campaigns like the more invested I got. And then when I also doubled down and knew about the impacts on Black people and people of color and like how important it was, I became a little angry and just being in an environment, and this is like 10 years ago, when I first started like looking around to my left and my right seeing my colleagues that looked nothing like me, I was annoyed I was like staying out of spite to be completely honest. To show them like, “Yo, we can do this too like this is important. Like it ain’t just for y’all.” So like we can’t just have these people do it. So like what brought me into it was like a fight that I had um like inside of me saying that like I need the voice to be out there I need this to be represented.
Ish Because I love when Black people get uplifted I love when we do have that moment to kind of really really be our full selves and show it to that space and just not be left behind. So that’s kind of like what brought me to it. It was to start in spite I’m not even gonna lie.I was like, “all these white people are getting promoted and hired and like being able to do all this stuff that I know I’m way better at.” And I like really really was like this is not a feeling that I want people to have in there. But I also like to know that people are not alone. People are not alone in this fight. There’s a community that we can build and there’s still systems and stuff that we can keep trying to tear down. So like my position now, I’m a recruiter. So noone can come into the organization without seeing me first. 
Lauren Yes, yes.
Ish So best believe all these hiring managers get everything from me here and I tell them like, “Hey you’ve seen your team. You know what we’re trying to do as an organization.” I think that’s something that has kept me in the movement too, kind of the amount of power that I now have to kind of be in the room and have that conversation. Like Isa said, “I’m rooting for everybody Black.” Like I want to make sure that we have fair chances all the way through and like to have people in those places I think is very important. So knowing like that is the impact that I have that’s kind of like what keeps me going too.
Lauren Yes, you really speak to something that a lot of us try to work on as human beings and that’s just like transmuting your anger into action and it sounds like you you really found… you found a moment where you could do that and then you built on like the disproportionality that you were seeing being here at the organization and you leveraged it and you became a recruiter and I just want to also give a shout out like Ish is the reason I’m here y’all. Like like Ish got me at Greenpeace. Yes.
Ish I aint gone hold y’all. It was a lot of anger I ain’t even gone hold you.
Lauren Yes, yes four snaps in the circle.
Lauren Jonathan would you like to tell us a little bit about what brings you to this movement and if you want to honestly give a little bit on the story that led you to even join um, joining this environmental movement and just being where you are right now?
Jonathan yeah hmm. Yeah get that church mother hmmmm. For me like movement um is something that that has always been intertwined in my life and so I think we don’t have time here to go through my whole life story right? But like I feel like for me especially like as I am getting older.  I am finding myself like really looking at how I was raised and the circumstances I endured and movement always being an element there. Definitely growing stronger over the years as I grew up, became a quote unquote adult, high school, college, developing my own political analysis of the world. But I feel like it wasn’t like, “and boom here’s a moment where like now you’re in the movement.” I think there’s always been these little points right? fFom the first time I was ever detained by the police at the age of about  8 throughout the rest of my life that I’ve endured whether it’s police violence, loved ones who are dealing with mental health and and not being treated as human. You know, working on different–what I didn’t know then, but now understand now as campaigns for people to have housing through the work that my mother did when I was growing up as well as education justice. I think there were always these elements there. And even I would say my first touch point with like “movement lawyering” which I think there’s a lot to unpack when we talk about “movement lawyering,” which I think again is its own conversation came from my grandfather who was who is my father figure throughout my life until he passed in 2011. Where literally in no exaggeration, you probably hear it in like movies but literally gave the clothes off of his back to like people. Um, and again on on his block would offer services, legal services to people to keep people out of jail, really use his law degree in service of the people. And I think not just the leadership examples I had of people in my community, but also my direct family members who were that example. So in this season of my life, that’s the answer I can provide for you is that I think there have been those entry points and so for me and again linking it to something that Ish had mentioned.
Jonathan Like I think that there are these roles that people play and I think that’s why.. well let me expand. I think it’s super important that we show up as authentically as we can in this world and be who we are um because the corny ted talk line is, “that’s what matters there’s only one you!’ But also it’s it’s real and I feel like again, as folks mentioned, if it wasn’t for Ish I wouldn’t have had that touch point with Greenpeace um, which allowed me a number of other opportunities. But ,again I feel like I’m I’m just blessed to be able to be in the space and and continue to grow.
Lauren You know, I definitely resonate with this idea of showing up as who you are authentically, because you never know who you will inspire to do the exact same and I can even say just in my short stint at Greenpeace, Jonathan I always looked up to you. And just thought you, you just entered every space virtual– virtual or in- person with just such poise. You definitely silently commanded a room– sometimes you didn’t need to say anything and people people really respected you and I respect you. And I just want to say, like you constantly showing up unapologetically and and being who you are just really inspires me, and I’m sure countless others who probably just haven’t had the opportunity to tell you that. So, just wanted to offer that. I do want to ask folks, if you had one thing to say to that young activist who is actually thinking about throwing in the towel right now. Maybe they want to go corporate. Maybe they’re looking– they’re ah harkening on that old defeatist adage where it’s like, “if you can’t beat them, join them.” What would you say to them, to keep them in the movement to cause them to say like “you know this is worth the fight and it’s gonna be long and hard but it’s worth continuing on. What’s something you would give that person?
Ish First I say go make that money. Nah  just just joking just joking. But Iwhat I would tell a young activist now and it’s funny I get these questions a lot lately I feel so old now. I just hit 30 so I’m like been in this game for a little bit and like people are like, “What would you say for someone that’s starting out?” and I’m like “don’t lose hope.” Like that’s kind of like the main thing that I hit. Like don’t lose hope and don’t forget what you’re fighting for and just like as long as it’s like still true to you then it’s true. So it doesn’t really matter how anyone else impacts it, but if you know that what you’re doing is like the right move for you, then you should be listening to yourself more than anything. So, there may be times where you gonna be frustrated, but I always go back to like what brings me to the work like what brings me to the moment to keep me going. And if I’m like “this is where I still stand,” still ride with it. If not then start exploring other things like. Also don’t let it like inhibit you from what you want to do further. Like things do change but just recognize that. So remember why you fight and if it’s time to start another fight that you’re more invested in don’t be afraid to make that jump.
Jonathan Yeah. I Love that. A huge plus one to what Ish offered, but then also it really does have to be for me finding an organizing home and being in community with people who are gonna hold you accountable. I appreciate the affirmation and as I struggle always to receive affirmations but like for me, it’s like I would just immediately reflect the the affirmation you gave me back to you all on this call. I know all of you all have had an immense impact on my life and the way I’m able to show up and be myself. Part of that comes through when you talk about movement work is having an organizing space where like: you can fail, you can try some things, you can get called In. You can– you can have some hard conversations but you can also have these really vibrant, beautiful conversations where like you can build that trust with people and understand that like the way I show up or at least that I aspirationally want to show up is always wanting to be in the posture of learning and growing and knowing that like at the end of the day. Um, we can always go off and do great things but it’s always gonna be about–, it’s not about the “I” It is about the community and who are you accountable to and how you can keep yourself growing so just finding that space and and committing to it.




Soundcheck skit


Rico: Okay, cool. We’re recording right now. Um, and I just want to check everybody’s mic one by one. Can we start with you lauren?


Lauren: Check 1 2, 1 2. 


Rico:I think you can turn down a little bit to on your gin. So now– yeah now you’re real crispy. 


Lauren: Now its real lit okay


Jas Does this sound good?


Rico: Jas are you are you able to turn yours up just a little bit? 


Jas: Is there any background noise?


Rico: I think that’s good. Can we go to ish.


Ish: All right lets see if this sounds good…oh you made a face so this already seems like this is about to be downhill


Rico: Yo, so Ish 1 thing with that mic, its is way different depending on if you face it or not so if you wherever you put it, you just gotta be mindful of that. But I think it sounds pretty good. Jonathan, can you uh can you check for us?


Jonathan: Ah, yeah, no, my zoom is updating and this microphone is being anti-Black.


Rico: Well I’m ah Imma stop it and check I think I think we’re solid..


Track 3 – Behind The Scenes


Jas So for today I wanted to discuss what it’s like behind the scenes of creating the podcast and I wanted to talk to Rico and Ish just about the process. So how did this podcast come into being? What is the inspiration, um, for the podcast.
Rico I’ve never been on this side of the um of the podcast so this is great. The podcast came into being in the spring of 2020 when as an org we were just like okay all the things we had planned for the year aren’t gonna happen. Um, or many of them aren’t we needed to be doing some different things and so there was this this challenge called the “Big Idea Challenge” which I believe Ish was one of the people who made that challenge happen.
Ish Ah, oh yeah, that was so much fun.
Rico And so there were actually two different teams that both came up with the idea for this podcast. One of the teams was just like strictly Black folks at the org I believe um, the I think you’re called the Black Power Rangers. 
Jas And Black Power Re-arrangers. Yeah, that was my group. Yeah yeah.
Rico Yeah, you were in that group right? Yeah yeah, and then I was in Aria which was just like we combined Alice, Rico, Irene, and Avery so we got Aaria. And we also came up with a podcast and so then we sort of, as Power Rangers do, we combined our powers made a Megazord and and work together to create it. So I mentioned some of the staff that were involved but um, also Ash who was on the action team at the time. Um, who are all the folks Jonathan.
Ish Layla was also in there too.  
Jas Layla.
Ish I just remember seeing that idea and I was like this just seems really really cool. Let’s go podcast for Black People. So shout out to y’all really quick I want to throw it in there.
Rico And so we wanted to like focus on some of the stuff some of the stories that we don’t always highlight in our in the rest of our work we wanted to you know, bring on people who are like doing directly impacted work, frontline folks and we have a lot of those connections and wanted to have an opportunity to have conversation with people about topics that are maybe a little bit adjacent to the work but not necessarily the things that the dominant environmental conversation always covers. 
Jas What is the process like for choosing a topic for an episode? So the first episode was environmental justice; you kind of touched on wanting to make adjacent episodes. But how is that process…how does that process work?
Ish I can touch base on that one and actually really like the process because I call myself probably like the baby of the group. One of the newest ones to come to it. I remember seeing the pitch, I was like oh it’s cool and was just biting my, biting my nails waiting to get involved into this as well. But, to kind of really talk about, like how we come up with the topics has been kind of enlightening to see. Like, we meet once or twice a week to kind of talk about different things that’s happening into the world that’s happening into the movement and also happening with Black People in general. A lot of things have been brought up and we’re like, “but what about this? How does this connect to the environment?” and like there’s just so many things that connects the environment and like the disparities put on Black People that we really really just have these in- depth conversations during those meetings and be like wait. This is our topic. This is kind of like the headline and then we started going even more into a specific topic until we have that content. So I do love it. It’s just like a Black brainstorm just kind of going through and just kind of talking about what we’re feeling and also what’s happening in the world and then we want to put that to something that’s digestible for the public. So that’s kind of like how that method works. The brainstorm sessions and really just creating it out of that.
Rico Yeah, and I think one of the things that’s been really fun about working on this team is people’s willingness to go– like dig in further. Like people will go do the research and spend the time and like shout out to you Jas I feel like you have that you have that energy– like heavily and it’s actually been really inspiring and has encouraged me to do more of it. But just like the willingness to be like all right I don’t know enough about this, how can I find out all the things? And that’s like a really fun part of the process that isn’t just the recording.
Jas Yeah, that nerd energy. But yeah, shout out to research. Within trying to create an episode and like we’re doing all these like fun little brainstorms, how do we identify who are we going to bring onto the show like what goes into selecting a person or a group of people? What criteria do we look for?
Rico I think that kind of varies, right, like um, a lot of times. it’s based on our connections you know or or just like just outside of our connections. Sometimes even the topic is a little bit informed by like. We know this person who’s doing this incredible work. It would be great.–We need to talk to them about something. So sometimes it works like that. But other times it works in the exact opposite way: like we know the topic, we really want someone and maybe we need to reach outside of our network to find the exact person who like– either because of the work they’re doing or because of their research or because of their orientation to the issue they’re like the perfect person. So it can kind of work in any of those ways, and both and, and everything in between.
Ish Yeah, for sure I do love how Rico puts that like um when we’re thinking about what topic we want we can see like who’s doing what in our networks and if it’s not necessarily there we do the research. Shout out to research again because that’s making another comeback but we really really try to see who would kind of provide a different type of value to what we need in these episodes and one thing that I remember that was told to me when I jumped on that we’ve always seen is we’re always looking to uplift those voices as well. So it’s a lot of Black People that are doing the work in the different areas and just really uplifting those people and giving them a chance to be on a podcast like Greenpeace that is sponsoring it for the most part like I think it’s really really cool to give those people a voice that can be elevated even more than what they have in that local network. So I kind of like that aspect and we get to learn so much more. So there’s a lot of learning that comes from those people so I’m glad that is how we kind of search and find those people.
Jas Yeah I agree. I like that we make it a point to reach and uplift grassroots people working at the heart of the issues on the front lines and it’s also just really nice to meet new people. So yeah, I definitely think it’s a really fun and creative process from the genesis of creating an episode to who are we gonna bring on and talk to about these topics. So one of my favorite things about the podcast is making the parody ads. So why do we do the parody ads instead of like maybe running real ads or something like that?
Rico The parody as are so much fun. They’re like,  there’s so much fun to make so much fun to brainstorm about. Even like the rejected ones that don’t make it on? I still have some that I’m like yo. “How can we bring this back?” Like the Sponsor A Vegan one at some point that has to happen. Um. But yeah I don’t I don’t know like the genesis of that parody ad idea I do know that that was from the Black Power Ranger group like the other half like when we Megazorded it, y’all had the parody ads idea and I was so hype about it. I’m like man this is brilliant I’ve never seen anyone do it but shout out to Greenpeace–we don’t do like corporate sponsorships right? So we wouldn’t  have you know an actual ad by Amazon for example and maybe Legal will flag me saying Amazon but ah, but we can definitely do a parody ad about a company that may or may not be Amazon so those those kinds of things I think it’s it’s an opportunity to like explore the topic from a different way. There’s kind of like just the bare bones research. There’s the like personal experience and stories that you get from the experts and the people who are doing the work but then like sometimes you just need a little extra, another way to to make the same point or to reinforce it so the parody ads to me are like some of my favorite parts of the show.
Jas I Totally agree. Um, I would recommend all of us to, you know, enroll in some standup comedy ventures. But yeah, the parody ads, as I remember it. It came out of like a “yes, we probably can’t solicit for money but also like this is going to be a heavy dark topic potentially, how do you break that up?” So yeah, it’s a really fun process. I thoroughly enjoy it.
Rico Jas, do you have a favorite parody ad?
Jas Ummm…I like the one that just aired from the Data Justice 1 where Ish was singing um, that’s 1 of my favorites. I just thought it was like so fun but also like really good and just like showcases all the talent that has accumulated here. So Kudos to both y’all. 

So this is a small podcast group but we obviously don’t– this doesn’t happen within like a silo. So like, are there any other people we’d like to give a shout out to who’ve definitely helped get our episodes out the door?

Rico Yeah, for sure people to shout out. All the folks who like have been a part of the team–  folks that are no longer at Greenpeace.  I mentioned some of them, I’ll mention some of them again. So, Ash– this podcast wouldn’t have existed without Ash. Shout out to Alice. Shout out to Irene who is still with Greenpeace but is no longer working on this particular project. Avery. Shout out to.. well Jonathan and Lauren who are on this episode who again, this podcast would not exist–definitely wouldn’t have made it through this season without all of the work and labor and energy and vibes and everything that they bring to the episode. Shout out Maggie who does our legal review and is super fast and like listens fully to all the episodes and gives feedback and stuff. Um, I really appreciate that. Travis, who is no longer with the org who was doing a lot of our comms review and now Jenna is doing that. 
Jas Kaitlin Grable.
Rico Yes KG! Huge shout out. Yeah because she’s like 1 of the people who actually creates creative content to go along with it. You know when she’s putting them on the social stuff. 
Ish Kaitlin Grable. Yes, yes, please. for the socials. Thank you, Thank you.  And then the labor of like training us to do it too and bearing with this for sure. So just a big shout out to you too for that. Thank you KG. Also we got Layla, we got Tahirah, like shout out to them as well. So like yeah, there’s been people. They’ve been supporting this from behind the scenes on the behind the scenes session too. So which is actually pretty cool.
Jas Laya was a part of –we mentioned it before but part of the original Black Power rearRangers group which fused into What We Need Now. There’s also Shanta who’s given us some advice. Ranjani for also some of her support with reporting and data.
Rico Ryan Schleeter, who helped us get our soundcloud platform because it’s actually Greenpeace Canada had it. I mean we’re behind the scenes. I’m giving all the tea. So Ryan Schleeter helped point us in the right direction for that. Um, and also did a lot of our media work.
Jas Perry. 
Rico Perry as well.
Jas Didn’t mean to cut you off there.
Rico No you good. You’re good I need the help cause I’m like– I feel like I’m doing an Oscar speech somehow and like I’m just about to forget all these people who’ve done so much and and all the all the staff who give feedback you know? Um so shout out to Valentina and the Planeta G crew. 
Rico Peter um, they have ah they’ve definitely given us like feedback and helped us amplify stuff in the past and you know folks who like listen to that episode and tell us what they think is really nice.
Ish I’m just going to shut up James Mumm and Chris Lauth specifically like every time we put out an episode like to see the reactions that they give us all the time and I know that they’re listening So we know we recognize it. Thank you, we appreciate the support.
Jas It really does take a village, a mass of people to create a podcast. And it takes a lot of dedication. Everyone here on the podcast is super hard working and so creative. So yeah, it’s just been a lot of fun and has kind of been like a refuge, this podcast, at least for me. I’ll speak for myself.  
Rico Me too. Huge learning experience. 
Jas And I guess, I guess I’m just mostly reminiscing about all the people we’ve had with the Podcast team who are no longer with us. And just honestly, could not have done it without them.  
Ish Almost got the tears coming out. I was like, “whew.” 


Interlude: Black environmentalists in the wild

Oh crikey! You scared me! You can’t be sneaking up on me out here in the wild….Well while you’re here you’ll get a first hand look at one of the rarest sightings on Planet Earth. I’m sure you’ve guessed it right by now that’s a Black environmentalist….in the wild. Bloody amazing! I mean if you’ve never read about them, its actually a pleasure to meet one…

 Fun tidbit bit before we go in for the catch..when these Black environmentalists are in distress they are known to cry out….. “if we could say this without losing  our jobs!”“


Track 4 – If we could say this without losing our jobs…


Jonathan Hello and welcome to WQXTB 98.7 and a half, “The jam” where we are figuring out if we can say this without losing our jobs. And the answer is: of course we can. As the contemporary African proverb says, “it’s not shade if it’s the truth.” In this segment, we will be discussing some hard truths about the environmental movement and sharing some thoughts on how we think we can get better. Yes, so let’s dive in. Um. Yeah, so I wanted to hear from everyone in this section. Again, being a little clickbaity with “if we could say this without losing our jobs.” But I think there are some valid critiques that need to be uplifted, have been uplifted, continue to be uplifted around the environmental movement. Each of us working in this space, taking on different roles and leadership opportunities,  yeah. I think the broader question is maybe the framing of if you could just say this to your mainstream white white environmentalist, what would you say? But also just kind of digging into like when we think about environmentalism even though I’ve said it like 3 or four times already, I think I could offer to say that within  most people’s minds, it’s not who maybe we would think as environmentalist. Again, that’s kind of a leading question but I just want to kind of start there.
jas I can chime in first if that’s okay,  and I think this goes directly to what you had offered Jonathan with that lead in which is like the visual aspect or like what you imagine when you’re thinking of environmental activists. I think for me, um I started out in school studying environmental science and I was the only Black person in my entire.. program. That’s the word. Um, and it was really disheartening and I think that a lot of people did not see me or see the value of what I could bring and like just because I did not look like them. I wasn’t wearing Patagonia I wasn’t you know, wanting to go hiking with them on the weekends because I can appreciate nature but I also don’t have to be in nature all the time. I’m just saying. But I think for me, just like the image also is….presents as a barrier because that also then ingrains people to think that like, “oh well, you don’t have anything to offer to the space. What could you possibly contribute?” Which obviously narrows what the movement can actually achieve and do so…
rsisney For sure, I mean if I was gonna say something to the mainstream environmentalist audience specifically like white folks in the environmental movement, I would quote a wonderful parody ad put out by What We Need Now in Season 1, “It ain’t about you” and I think like. I Think the– the thing is for any position of privilege, like it’s hard to see yourself as having that identity. Like whiteness doesn’t look like a race, when that is the dominant culture similarly like for folks with like Cis-het privilege, like we don’t. We don’t see. We don’t see, what we don’t see and so I think that you know the environmental movement looks or the mainstream environmental movement looks white because the folks in it don’t think of it as “white” they think of it as everyone. And if it’s “Black” then that’s specific. That’s an identity. And so I think like just really recognizing that like you know. There’s a whole lot of perspectives. There’s a whole lot of people that have been doing this work for So. So so so so long and like it really don’t have to just be about you. And the proverbial “you” including me.
Lauren I too like I really identify with like this ‘it not being about you’ piece, and I think about like all the people who were quote-unquote environmentalists just without putting a name on it way before this became like a mainstream thing. I feel like white environmentalists, as well intentioned as they are, if they took the time to look at history and see that like there were so many groups well before them, like ethnic groups who were just always living on– with the land. You know what I mean? Like not on the land, not trying to own the land, but just with the land. They, they ate with the seasons. You know what I mean? And like all these things that we we call him these new…I don’t know it seems like the movement is just like, “Oh yeah, now people are gardening…” It’s like, “shawty we been doing this.” Like, like this is nothing new and if you like would take a second to listen to some of the people who you’ve oppressed for so many years like I’m sure you could learn a thing or two about environmentalism. I mean, and it’s and it’s also just really sad because we…we do these studies for instance on like “who cares about quote unquote “global warming?” But then we don’t ask the bigger questions of like actually what what groups of people are most in tune with the land? You know? If we were to reframe the questions that we’re asking. We’d probably find that people of color have been environmentalists in the mainstream ideology um way longer and and and we still hold then we still hold those natural inclinations to to care for the land. Um, I would say even even if we have been ah conditioned to be so um, you know mainstream and uh eurocentric at this point but I digress. Ah, that’s just what I would tell people.
rsisney Preach. Preach.
Jonathan Yes I love that um, and I think that’s actually a great segue to kind of… my second question is: I dare say if I ventured into any one of your homes, consensually um, not not breaking an entering um, ah but if I was ever to walk into one of you all’s homes, I dare say I would find, off a guess, a drawer that holds lots of silverware and condiments and things that get reused multiple times. Something in a pantry that is one plastic bag that has probably two-hundred more plastic bags inside of it. Um, let me know if I’m getting warm. You know like, the offering that that there’s few chances that there actually was a thing as a leftover because all food got eaten– eaten at one point in time. Um, so so I think we’re on this question of like– there’s nothing new and kind of under the reframe, as we’re having this critique of mainstream environmentalism and grounded in white supremacy and these ideals, what are some of the ways that you all have seen kind of environmentalism, conservationism or just environmental justice in your own lives? Again, just a quick touchstone of what that looked like–whether it’s like growing up or something contemporary, specifically because we’re all Black. Again, maybe you can’t tell that from the audio. Um, but Listeners. We are Black and so yeah, what? what was that? What’s what’s 1 thing you can offer in terms of like a reframe on like when we think about what it means to take care of the planet?
rsisney Going off of the example that you just gave, it just immediately makes me think of my grandma who has had the same Country Crock container. I don’t know if you know about Country Crock spread. It’s like not quite margarine, not quite butter, I don’t actually know what it is but it doesn’t matter because I’ve never actually seen Country Crock in it.  I’ve seen mashed potatoes in it. I’ve seen spaghetti in it. It’s like, that is a tupperware dish. She’s always has one of those that she reuses. Same thing with the plastic bags. 

But she’s also just like somebody in her community who, anything that she has, wherever it comes from if somebody wants to give her something, she’ll say yes, not because she needs it, but because she knows she will find who needs it. And so just like thinking about throwaway culture and how fashion works, and how people are like, “Oh I don’t fit this anymore” or “This isn’t– this doesn’t fit my style anymore.” My Grandma’s like “Yeah, give it to me and I’m gonna find somebody who needs it. And she’s been like that quietly, my entire life. iNobody really talks about it. We just understand that that’s what she does and I think that that orientation to like using things into they’re not useful is is is a really really powerful example of environmentalism to me.

Lauren Rico I’m– so I’m just like your grandma. Um, I do as a, you know, young, Black woman. I tend to keep a lot of things like old wine bottles that I’ve turned to little holders for my bamboo. And put it around my house. I try to always repurpose things that I’m just like, “Oh I’m just not comfortable giving this away.” Or like knowing that it might be thrown away and never used again. Or, you know who knows what’s happening with recyclable recyclables at this point, but that’s neither here nor there, that’s a whole nother podcast. Um, and I also think about my own mother, she doesn’t subscribe to throwaway culture either.  Whenever somebody is moving, whether it’s through through a yard sale or or maybe her office was moving, he ends up just taking on all the things. Um, and I wonder if reframing what it means to take care of the planet, I wonder if that aligns with just the idea of reframing who gets to take care of the planet. Right now we know that it’s the people who are in charge are typically from you know European nations and I say “in-charge,” even if we’re we’re looking at the U.N say from a global perspective. They they subscribe themselves as the the overarching power that makes the decisions, that manages our globe. But anyway, the jury might be out on that. But I wonder if it means that we need to sort of reframe who those people are who are in power. And maybe that means that we don’t, we no longer give them that ascribed power if that makes sense I Just mean that. Maybe some folks, you know, Cisgender men need to take a step back. Maybe the folks who, you know are white need to take a step back, or just maybe individuals in general who’ve had that power, even if it is individuals ah in of color, excuse me who’ve had that power. I just think that if we know we’ve tried these strategies and they’re not working and we’re just becoming more and more destructive in the in the name of efficiency, like maybe that means we need to pass the torch on to other people because this leadership– the people who have been in leadership just haven’t solved the problem yet. And I think it just needs to we need to let go of the ego and they need to be able to pass the torch.
Jonathan Yes, I appreciate all of those offerings. To wrap up our segment here today at w q x t b a b c d x y z um, one thing I wanted to kind of get a sense from is what is your one-sentence hard truth and/or hot take that you’d like to offer given what you’re seeing in the world? I know that’s a broad question but it’s meant to be broad but just kind of what we talked about today. And to kick us off I can start with my one sentence. It’s a short sentence. Um, and it goes like this… “just give the power back beloved.”
jas But um, the first phrase I came to my mind was “Move bitch, get out the way.” But I don’t think we’re allowed to keep that in the podcast. So I’m a go on mute until I think of a better thing to say.
rsisney We’ll ask Maggie it might work.
rsisney Mine would be… and yeah I’m still workshopping this. I just have Heroes and Villains in my head because Ish is going to a karaoke thing after this, but um, “we might be able to save the day if you stop trying to be the hero.”
jas Snaps for that
Lauren I’m gonna try this. This is an unfinished thought but it’s a sentence. bear with me. So “if insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result. Ask yourself if you are the problem and you are the reason why we have not solved climate change.”
jas And I just realized that I’m on you and people on audio won’t be able to hear or see the reactions that everyone just gave but it was a lot of snickering and covering of mouse.


Track 5 – After Party

Ish What’s up everybody? This is Ish and welcome to the 5th and final track of this episode that we’re gonna call The After Part. Right now, bringing it to you live and direct with a few of my colleagues who are phenomenal and amazing and we’re here to talk a little bit about what we do next. First question that I kinda wanna pose to y’all is just, in terms of campaigning what are organizations not doing that they should be doing to continue to fight for social and environmental justice? What barriers do you see in place and how can we like fight them? 

Jonathan Yeah, I think one of the things I continue to see in a lot of campaigns, just, broadly speaking, is people like having these mythical campaigns, in particular national organizations. Mythical campaigns like “we’re just gonna solve this thing and it’s going to be the most strategic thing in the world.” And they don’t speak to anyone who’s actually directly impacted. And people who are directly impacted are not actually a part of the process, not just like, “Oh, we talked to you one time, but like actually deeply involved building out the strategy, being in leadership, and then wonder why they’re not getting to real solutions. You know? If I was never a zookeeper why? Why am I the person up the front talking about zookeeping if I’ve never done that right? And so I think that’s one thing continuously, especially from national groups who we see that 

Jas For me, I’m not a campaigner. I’m just someone who observes things. So from this perspective, I think what I’ve seen or notice a lot from other organizations is that. I’m not saying Greenpeace is excluded from this grouping, but it’s a lot of…a lot of the campaigners are not people from these groups, so this kind of goes back to what Jonathan is saying of like they’re not from the community, but like it’s not even…I think it goes back to also like who’s already at the table or in the room being brought into these organizations. It’s if you’re going to have a campaign on, you know, liberating elephants like I would bring an elephant into the room. OK, that was really bad…

Lauren What I had to say. It seems like a lot of organizations just aren’t localized enough. These really large orgs you know, like the ones that we all work for or formally did work for. They tend to like, be really comfortable campaigning in those areas that already care about environmentalism.So we’re in this closed feedback loop to where that’s where the environmental movement quote unquote is. But it’s like, no, it’s really all over America. It. It just feels like we um… when you’re in a national framework, you’re dealing with people who you’re tailoring all your campaigns towards the people who give you the most money, and that’s because they know about the national campaigns. You know, those areas, like in the Pacific Northwest and on the West Coast. Like another organization that I know of, that’s very large, goes to a lot of different localized spaces, but again they only go to these areas where privileged people who have the opportunity to see themselves as environmentalists give money. They go to those particular areas which tend to be basically the rich, richer white areas and they call that “local on the ground organizing.” And it is don’t get me wrong, but it’s like, are you in the communities to actually need the work that you can offer them? So.

Ish Thank you all for sharing that. That was Lauren, that was Jas, that was Jonathan. They were really really phenomenal. I mean ‘are’ they’re still here in the present tense. But yeah, I just wanted to say thank y’all for that. ’cause yeah a lot of those things have been on my mind too. At least to Lauren your point a little bit. Like, and we talked about this before like who we target. Like who we need to kind of really really attract to kind of get our word out there like there’s a lot of organizations doing a lot of great work, but if this was me 15 years ago in Dallas, TX, I wouldn’t know anything about them like at all. ‘Cause like they aren’t catering to people like me. So like how can organizations do more of that? They say they’re on the forefront of the fight. They want to be there, they want to be an ally. They want to support, but you’re also ignoring a lot of voices. I wanna ask like I guess what’s next for What We Need Now as a team? Like what can we expect from us in the year 2022? What types of topics are we thinking about? What types of stuff should we be centering and focusing on? 

Jas The things that I hope to address next season is moving away from focusing kind of our attention on issues brought about through whiteness and more, so focusing on like us as people of color, like what are like–I understand this. We cannot divorce the too. Like if you’re in America, you are part of this system and this system is a white supremacist system. But, more directly talking to our issues that are directly impacting us, I think would be something I like to see. I think also, I would like to talk more about going back to like the idea of like having a role within the movement and I think that’s one thing. I think the other part of that is also how to balance… kind of living in the now. So like OK, we’re still in a capitalist society. We are facing all these things like there’s some thing so we cannot avoid that. You have to participate in. How do you juggle that with also balancing getting into work and trying to shift these things? I think that’d be a really interesting thing to kind of focus on, because that’s kind of the pressing question of like how do you push against these systems? How do you change these systems while still having to navigate it? Like for me I’m like I need to make money. I….We’re cutting it. We’re stopping before I get angry. 

Jonathan Yeah, and also again Black people. We gotta talk about money I. I think again, it’s a whole another podcast in it of itself. ‘Cause again we live in a capitalist society, and although we may not like–like how capitalist society works and want to alter that and change that like folks still have to like feed themselves and their families right? So I think there is a tension there, but like yeah Jas like get your money Boo. OK? And get that raise and get another raise. 

Lauren Yes secure the bag babe. Secure the bag. 

Jas it’s a privilege sometimes to be working in these organizations, for real. And you shouldn’t have to feel bad about doing what you have to do to get by.

Ish Love that. Again to something you said earlier too about taking it away from whiteness getting away from–I mean white supremacy is a thing. We know it is deeply rooted in our history. Being pro-Black to me, I don’t see a lot of mention about whiteness. Like, I love building Black love and kind of really recognizing and celebrating us too without having that dark cloud of oppression from white people historically. So, I do love centering blackness because it really, really gives that moment for us, and that’s something that they can’t take away. So I really, really do like that. 

Lauren Yeah, one thing I think organizations can do next is intentionally build campaigns that are centered around the people who are first and worst affected by climate change. Simple, we hear it all the time. But also build the strategies with those communities. You can’t come in with the ideas already planned. No. You need to come in, suggest what you can offer, suggest how you might be able to help, but build the strategy to accomplishing whatever the goal is with the communities. And in doing that, I think people need to intentionally target those Black and Latinx epicenters like Houston, where Ish is from, from Atlanta where Ish–scuse me Rico and I are from. Like these are spaces that that hold a lot of, you know, Black and Latinx wealth and and intelligence. In my– and I hate to say it like I’m trying to prove something, but it’s more like I think it’s something that the broader environmental movement hasn’t leveraged yet and I just I think they could really benefit from that, and they need to also target, you know, our youth. I never heard about. Greenpeace, while I was at my HBCU and a lot of HBCU friends that I have also have never heard of Greenpeace to this day. We need to also be more present in tribal colleges and predominantly Hispanic serving institutions. I think it just needs to be a little bit more intentionality behind it, because I think there’s this thing that I hear from people all the time where it’s just like: “Well, we’re open to everyone. This is a space for all.” And it’s like– it’s not just the “if you build it, we will come” because we have consistently been excluded from whatever institutions and organizations you built. And this has happened historically, so it’s… At this point you all have to come to us in order for there to be some real change made. Bring your resources, tell us what you can offer. Give us an idea of what you’ve done in the past, and be willing to build your strategies with those communities. 

Ish Dang I gave so many hand claps while I was on mute. But yes, yes, yes, yes please please. I also wanna say, I’m from Dallas. Texas people don’t come for me alright? I know Houston, I love Houston too but hey, I’m from Dallas. Alright? I know my Dallas people be listening too so they’re gonna be yelling at me like, “You from Houston now?”

Lauren My bad Ish. My bad

Ish I was like, “Wooh, can’t go home no more.”

Lauren I don’t wanna get you beat up now.


Ish But that’s all love. That’s all love. But hey, thank you all so much. I got one final thing for y’all and y’all know on the podcast what we like to do is uplift many different groups all the time. Many Black people out there doing the work. If we could just do a quick few shout outs of like groups out there that you like. That’s really, really doing nothing. And just like show them some love, ’cause I wanna keep uplifting. We wanna have our listeners know who they should be looking out for too, who they should support. And yeah drop those names. 

Lauren Yeah cool, I’m just doing my shout out real quick. West Atlanta Watershed Alliance. We out here doing the environmental justice work on the ground. Everything from water quality research to gentrification research. Also like trying to stop gentrification. And yeah, just a ton of things. We’re also giving kids who typically don’t get access to outdoors. We’re giving them opportunities. It’s just a really great space. I would just honestly suggest that people look us up on the website. A wonderful local organization that is near and dear to my heart and really caused me to stay in the environmental movement.

Jonathan For me, shout out to all the pineapple and melon sellers on the street corner. Shout out to your local Co-op. Shout to Parable of the Sower Co-op, in particular Soulfire farm. Flint Rising, Flint still does not have clean water. Shout out to organizers who’ve been organizing there for years and continue to fight. Shout out to the Red, Black and Green New Deal. Yeah, shout out to any black person who is out there like doing the work again. As it’s already said, I’m rooting for everyone. Black 


Ish Really, really appreciate it. And that’s us. That’s it. This is the after party. Catch ya in 2022. Wherever you listen to your podcast, we love being here with you.

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